Online dating enda me

Kuidas mehed Tinderis edukamad oleksid

2020.10.12 21:35 Ratohnhakeeton Kuidas mehed Tinderis edukamad oleksid

Vabandan ette kui keegi on juba naise vaatepildist ette jõudnud. Leidsin paar threadi tööl top postitusi kerides ning teadsin kohe, et see on minu teema. Kindlasti tuleb ka meeles pidada, et igaüks kasutab Tinderit omamoodi ja omadel eesmärkidel.

Sissejuhatuseks
Olen ise kahekümnendate esimeses pooles ning Tinder on minu jaoks üks parimaid äppe, mis sotsiaalvõrgustikuks olemas on, eriti siis veel, kui sai tudeng oldud. Kasutanud olen Tinderit umbes 2018. a suvest saadik, kuid kasutaja pole mul olnud pooltki 2a järjest - maksimaalselt on see mul olnud u 5 kuud ning minimaalselt paar nädalat. Kohtinguid ei suuda enam kokku lugedagi, rääkimata suhtluskaaslastest, kuid arvatavasti on neid üle 20 ning suures enamuses on olnud kõik väga positiivsed.
Tinderi ELO hakkas mulle juba varasemalt niisama huvi pakkuma ning kuna üks erialaaine oli sellega seotud (kuidas me oma partnereid valime, mis on iludus, mis on isalikkus, kumb trumpab kumma jne), sai arutatud nii õppejõudude kui ka kursakatega seda kunsti, mis on online dating - mida me profiilides näeme ning kuidas ise selles eriti edukas olla. Siin keskendun peamiselt Tinderile.

Alustuseks, Tinderi ELO süsteem ja kuidas seda tõsta
See on täiesti tõsi, et Tinder kategoriseerib inimesed skaalal 1-10. Isiklikult olen olnud nii 10 skooril kui ka 1-3 kanti skooril, seetõttu oskan sel teemal palju rääkida. Kohe alustuseks:
  1. aktiivsus loeb. Mida aktiivsem sa oled, seda parem. Mida rohkem sa lükkad, seda parem. Mida rohkem sa kirjutad, seda parem. Mida rohkem sa ise vestluseid alustad, seda parem. Sinu ekraaniaeg loeb palju, mistõttu sa suudad oma ELOs kiiresti ülespoole tõusta. Küll aga tuleb arvatavasti mingiaeg limiit peale (Tinderi algoritmi on vahepeal muudetud, mistõttu proovivad mõned ajakirjanikud endiselt aru saada, kuidas hetkel täpselt ELO arvutatakse), kus enam oma skoori niisama aktiivsusega tõsta ei saa. Siit ka järgmine punkt
  2. Välimus loeb. Tinder matchib sind sinu skaalal inimestega, ehk kui Tinderi arvates sa kuulud skaalale 7, siis ta viskab sulle ette inimesed skaalal 6-8. Mõnikord viskab ta ka ette skaalal 9 olevad inimesed, neid tasub kindlasti püüda. Inimeste skaalade arvutamine on suhteliselt delikaatne kunst, kuid kui piisavalt profiile läbi käia, hakkad aru saama, milline profiil võiks olla kõrgel skaalal ning milline väiksemal.
  3. Match percentage loeb. Kui matchid ilusamate profiilidega kui su skoor, tõuseb ka sinu skoor. Madalamate profiilide puhul samamoodi. Mida madalamate profiilidega inimesed sind paremale lükkavad ning mida vähem suuremate skooridega profiilid sind vasakule lükkavad, kukub ka su ELO madalamate profiilide tasemele.
  4. Liiga palju swaipimist kas paremale või vasakule toob samuti kaasa skoori languse. Arvatavasti vananenud andmete põhjal tohtis see olla vastavalt 90%-10%, kuid kõige turvalisem oleks jääda kuskil 80-70% kas vasak/parem swaip ning 20-30% vastavalt. Tinder teab, kui sa oled desperate.
  5. Uued kasutajad saavad "newbie boosti". Kui teed omale uue kasutaja, siis oled nähtav u 24h väga suurele seltskonnale. Nii arvutataksegi sinu esimene skoor välja. Küll aga ei tööta enam kasutaja kustutamine ning uuesti tegemine, et oma skoori resettida. Kunagi see töötas, enam ei tohiks. Kui tahadki kasutaja kustutada, pead arvestama, et sellisel juhul sa ei tohiks u 2 kuud uuesti kasutaja teha, muidu võidki kohe alguses saada omale väga madala skoori. Siit suur nõuanne! Tee oma kasutaja reedel õhtul kell 8. Nii käib kõige rohkem rahvast Tinderist läbi ja võib skooriga vedada.

Bio loeb. Aga ei loe ka.
Bio valikute kohta leiad sa kohutavalt palju arvamusi. Osade jaoks loeb, osade jaoks mitte. Küll aga kehtib üks suur põhitõde: kui bio ajab naerma, saad arvatavasti matchi. Tühi bio on nii ja naa, minu jaoks isiklikult ei tähenda see väga midagi, aga kui bios on midagi väga naljakat või selline Eesti huumorile viitav (a la paneme hevi käima ning teeme vorstikastet), on see juba väga suur võit ning tuleb lüke paremale. Nii saad filtreerida ka oma kanti inimesed välja, mis töötab päris hästi. KÜLL AGA. Siit tuleneb ka sihtmärk, mida sa Tinderis saavutada tahad. Kui tahad filtreerida inimesi, kes vastaks sinu ootustele, siis pane see biosse kirja ja ära raiska oma aega. Nii võid kaotada küll ELO, aga samamoodi võib olla ka väga püss inimene sinuga samas ELOs, sest tema bio ei sobi kõrgematele skooridele. Küll aga see pole raudreegel, ilusad inimesed püsivad tavaliselt ikka kõrgemal. Samuti on ka väga palju neid, kes biosid ei loe. Naised vaatavad keskmiselt profiili mitmeid kordi kauem kui mehed.
Haridus loeb. Haridusega inimesed üldjuhul saavad kõregmatele skooridele ligi. Pole päris kindel, kas see on nende suhtlusviisi tõttu või lihtsalt kõrghariduse "prestiiž". Kindlasti soovitan ülikooli omale biosse lisada.
Pane biosse see kirja, kuidas sa tahad, et inimesed sind näeksid. Bio on kõige esimene lause, mida sa enda kohta öelda saad. Pane see maksma!

Eesti meeste raskus - pildid
See on probleem, millest ei saa üle ega ümber. Üleüldiselt näen, et Eesti meestel pole häid pilte Tinderis. Inimene näeb tõesti välja Tinderis tihti heal juhul 5/10, aga kui näed millalgi päriselus, on hoopiski 10/10. Seega tasub küsida sõpradelt/tuttavatelt, et ehk teeksite paar pilti juurde. Kuid kindlasti hoidke oma pildid väga erinevad, 3-4 samasugust kuid veidi erineva poosiga pilti ei vii kuhugi.
Selfide kohta on suhteliselt nii ja naa. Kui kõik pildid on selfid, on see pigem halvapoolne. Üldine põhitõde oleks selline: üks selfi, üks pilt loomaga, üks pilt sõpradega, üks pilt looduses, üks-kaks täispikkusega pilti (boonusena ka üks naljakas pilt). See viib kohutavalt kaugele ja sellised profiilid on pigem Eestis haruldused.
Palja ülakeha ja jõusaali pildid. Siin samuti palju arvamusi. Kui tahad näidata, näita. Üldiselt tundub, et see naistele väga peale ei lähe (arvatavasti sümboliseerib fuckboy elustiili), kuid kui leiad mõne spordiinimese, paneb ta sulle võibolla matchi. Küll aga on selliseid jõuksi peeglipilte väga palju, kui tahad palja ülakehaga/jõuksi pilti, mõtle midagi huvitavat välja.
Kaitseväe pildid. Nii ja naa. Kui kõik pildid on KV-s tehtud, tekib pigem arvamus, et kui mehega suhtled, vastab teisel pool ekraani sulle 20 pealine jõuk. Üks-kaks pilti on toredad, kõik mitte. Targem oleks ka KV-d bios mitte mainida (seda esineb lihtsalt jube palju).
Proovi ennast näidata piisavalt hästi. Head pildid võivad skoori tõsta, aga kui oled väga erinev pilditelt ja päriselust, siis võib jääda (ja tavaliselt jääbki) su esimene kohting mingi matchiga viimaseks.

Vestlus
Siin ei oska mingeid nõuandeid tuua. Naljad, viisakus, tavaline suhtlus kestab hästi. Tihti saad inimese oleku või suhtlusviisi kiiresti teada, mille tõttu saad aru, kuidas temaga edasi suhelda. Siin oskan tuua vaid endapoolseid nõuandeid:
  1. naised saavad väga palju sõnumeid. Ära kohku, kui vastamine võtab kaua või seda ei juhtugi. Ja kui see juhtub isegi kuu pärast, proovi mõista. Mõnikord pole teine pool süüdi, mõnikord ausalt polegi aega.
  2. kui ta jääbki igavaks, ära raiska aega. Siuke edasi-tagasi tühi suhtlemine on kahjuks norm. Võid oma selga murda vestluse kandmisel, aga kui sealt midagi ei tule, las ta jääda.
  3. Üldiselt on nii, et hea inimesega jutt jookseb. Ja jääbki jooksma. Sellise inimese leidmine võib võtta kaua aega, midagi pole teha. Kannatus on põhiline.
  4. Kõhutunne on põhiline. Liiga pealetükkivad saadetakse ära. Kui vestlus kisub imelikuks, lõpetatakse ka. Ei tasu riskida, seega ärge andke põhjust, miks keegi peaks seda tundma.

Viimaseks, Tinderi sätted
  1. võta kohe smart pictures maha. See viskab su piltide järjekorra sassi. Juhul kui sa tead, et su pildijärjekord on päris hea (a la see mis ma üleval näiteks tõin), siis see töötab paremini.
  2. Kasuta Top Picke. Saad ühe päevas, make it count.
  3. Vanus ja distants ei loe otseselt. Kasuta kuidas tahad, suurem distants aitab paremini ELO tõsta.
  4. Pane asukoha säte ainult peale siis, kui äppi kasutad.
  5. Võib olla parem, kui võtad ka Top Picksi maha. Siis ilmud rohkem inimeste ekraanile. Seda pead aga ise otsustama, kas tahad olla üks ilusate seas või esineda rohkem kaardipakis.

Tinder Gold
Töötab, kuid ainult siis, kui oled ilus. See hoiab aega kokku, kuna tänu sellele saad kiirelt vaadata, kes on sind juba paremale lükanud. Samuti on Top Picks väga hea funktsioon oma ELO tõstmiseks või lihtsalt ilusate inimestega matchimiseks. Ainult väga kallis.

Nõuannete leiunurk
  1. Kui reisid näiteks Tartust - Tallinna, tee igas suuremas vahelinnas Tinder lahti. Nii lähed kohe kohalike kaardipakki, leiad ehk ilusaid ja huvitavaid inimesi.
  2. Kui elad Tartus, kuid oled nt nädalavahetuse Tallinnas, hoia oma äpp nii kaua Tallinnas kui saad. Näiteks kui lahkud linnast kell 12, kuid teed äpi lahti alles Tartus kell 5, siis sa oled nähtav tallinlastele tervelt 5 tundi rohkem. See paneb sind suuremale seltskonnale nähtavale ja võid oma ELO tõsta.
  3. ..täiendan kui veel miskit meelde tuleb

Kokkuvõte
Üldiselt olen isiklikult näinud, et Eesti online dating platvorm on väga madal võrreldes näiteks Rootsi, Soome ning USA-ga, kus inimestel on kordades parem profiili ehitus ning vestlusjaotus. Seetõttu ehk aitab see guide kedagi.
Igaüks otsib Tinderis seda, mida/keda tahab ning ehk leiab ka selle, mida/keda tahab. Küll aga tuleb suhtuda seda pigem kui hobisse, äkki veab. Suurte lootsutega üldiselt ei tasu minna, aga samuti ei tohiks ka lootusetu olla. Nii on vastused alati jäänud kahte leeri: "Tinderis normaalseid inimesi pole" vs "aga ma ju leidsin oma kaaslase Tinderist..."
Tegelikult oleks sel teemal rääkida veel nii nii palju, teadusliku pooleni ei jõudnud, aga hetkel enam ei jaksa. Seetõttu küsige nii palju kui võimalik, proovin neile vastata ja mingit pointi ehk veel täiendada.
submitted by Ratohnhakeeton to Eesti [link] [comments]


2020.07.20 14:12 CinnamonCat_ Why are you gay interview Copypasta (found in youtube, source below) (hopefully this counts as copypasta)

Simon: Hello and welcome back this is the topical discussion on the morning breeze on nbs television, my name is Simon Kangualiala. We bring in the studio this morning one of the gae rights activists: mr. - should i call you Mr??- Pepe Julien Onzima, thank you for coming in, good morning WHY ARE YOU GAEH?
Pepe: Who says I'm geh?
Simon: YOU are gae.
tunnnn
Simon: lesbian???? Homosexual?? You are a transgEnda
Pepe: I......am Pepe Julian Onsima....I'm a human rights defenda..UNM-
Simon: You are gae rights activist, why should someone be GEII ??
Pepe: When you're growing up you're.. (👁️👁️) You're within a society that..has..
Simon: -SO as we stand today, are you dating any female?
Pepe: Yes I Am.
Simon: you have a girlfriend👈🏿
Pepe: Yes I Du.
Simon: You perform the natural.."obligations"?
Pepe: 😳aaaahhh, hehhh...... I'm not sexually active right now.
Simon: 🧐 doesn't that make you GAE?
Pepe:...i am I AM male, and I'm attracted to female-
Simon: -SO WHO IS GAEH?? SO as a human rights activist, what do you think of Geis?
Pepe: h-
Simon: And the- is no- is it normal to be gay?
Pepe: absolutely, i mean......umm.... Most p most people ... 👐🏽W🤲🏾w👐🏽 We had the cha- (🧐) nnnnnuuummnn
Simon: why do you recruit young boys?? and gals, into-into this ✌🏿""gay activism""✌🏿?? (🥛) tac
Pepe: there is NO such thing-
Simon: WELL WE HAVE UH...PASTA SEMPA ONLINE, an anti gay activist to tell us his side of the story. HALO PASTA!!?
Pasta: Yes good morning everyone
Simon: Good to have you online how are you todae?
Pasta: I am doing well,
Pasta: m really uhm extremely ???? shshshshshsfffshhh
Pasta: WE HAVE THESE ISSUES and ?????? Chance to ???? ONZIMA ?? puu pe piii
Simon: 😳 OH sorry, we lost him along the way. A, u- oh oh e- LEGALLY, is there any good justification for Homosexuality?
Pepe: I told you I am a human rights defender (📙) And..... UHM...???? Thanks for your time (🍌) I cannot go on with this any-
Pasta: Before you go can you recognize these things?? (🥒)
Simon: Pepe, I'm sorry can you give me- can can you give me a minute??
Pasta: PEPE do you do you recognize some of these things heAre? 🍌🥒 These are some of the things that you use a-
Simon: PASTA!!!! I'M KEEPING TOO HARSH CAN YOU ? ????
Pasta: A nononononono
Simon: triggered WHY CAN'T YOU WHY FOR ONCE CAN'T YOU REALIZE??
Pasta: Carot is a ???? ?????carot??? No ????🍌🥕🥒 She thinks she's a man...but she does NOT HAVE THE EQUIPMENT to be a MAn. So what do they do?🍌🥒🥕To be able- They put it inside you, you rip o you urena retract🍌🥕🥒areas. When they put it (🍌) inside the behind ??????
Simon: 🤔 Hm.
Pasta: ABANA!???!??? (((🥕🥒🍌)))
Simon: BUT this is a disorda! Right??
Pasta: AHAAAAA....
Simon: If it's a disorda
Pasta: yes
Simon: Do you feel you're handling it the right wae??
Pasta: YeEeEess to make sim-
Simon: I'M GLAD Pepe is back
Pasta: I'm glad he has/ she has decided to ??-
Simon: CAN YOU shake hands before we proceed?
Pasta: Of COOOURSE👋🏾HOW ARE YOU PEPEE?? 🤝 🤝 🤝 Mmsawa?!???????? 🤝??!????📙???
Simon: 🤓 Pasta NO HAHA ????? 😃 (cringe) please
Simon: A, Pasta Sempa and you, is that theese (🍌) are the instruments you use
Pasta: aahhhaaaaaa
Pepe: These are vegetables🤦🏿‍♀️
Pasta: AAHHAAAAAA
Simon: Yes-
Pasta: ??? 🍌👐🏽Uganda🍌👐🏽Africa🍌👐🏽Sodome(?) association ????? (🤓)
Simon: Can he just fay That?
Pasta: mmAAAAAHH🍌❌
Simon: just a second! Can you just say that
Pasta: ????
Simon: Let me give you a chance to respond (👄🍌) Ah.. Pepe... (👁️👁️👄)
Pepe: just translate this to ?????
Simon: PEPE-
Pepe: is there only ONE way to have children? Is there only one way-
Simon: yes there is. 😐
Pepe: really?
Simon: Yes there is.😐
Pasta: (🍌👄) MMHHM👆🏾??? IT'S she's a WOMAN!! BUT she's thinking-
Pasta: escuse me if- I'm giving her a chance
Pepe:✋🏽stop insulting me ???
Pasta: you see: 🍌an AP-- A BANANA is different from a 🥒cucumBA. A carrot🥕 is different from 🥒a banana, i want you to understand
Pepe: THAT IS FOOD!!THAT IS FOOD
Pasta: NOOO these are not equal! So for you-
Pepe: sisisisisisisissisiisisisis
Pasta: what tribe are you by the way? pemp
Pasta: ????? 👋🏾??? What CLAN are you? pemp
Pasta: 👋🏾??? ACDC do you have fathers and grandfathers?? tonnnnn
Simon: of course he does
Pasta: ??????? WHAT IS YOUR TRIBAL NAME?
Simon: What-wha
Pasta: NABANABANABASUKUALEKE????? AFRICA THAT IS SO BAAAAAAN🤛🏾
Simon: pasta.. If he's no-
Pepe: let me tell you Simon, as I am here, my family supports me. confusion
Simon: ARE THE SUPPORTING A DISORDAH ????😨
Pepe: I I I Am a human rights defenda, I'm not limited
Simon: You, you are an activist for L G
Simon+Pasta: B T
Simon: I (?)
Pepe: I-
Simon: LESBIANS GAYS UHM
simon+pasta: BISEXUALS
Pasta: abobobonuawuabua
Simon: TRANSGENDA and intersexuals
Pasta ?????
Pepe: let me tell you something
Simon: WHERE'S THE _H_??
Pepe: gay gasp HUMAN RIGHTS i told you earlier (👁️👁️)
Pasta: ????? gehEHEHEHEHEHE
Pepe: I am fo? This gr-
Simon :NONONONO PASTA PASTA hold it please
Pasta: agaAAAAA hahahahah
Simon: Pasta ahn PEPE
Pepe: I cannot believe you put me on a show and humiliate me
Pasta: HAHHAAA
Pepe :can the Pasta shut up when I say because he's been interrupting and probably-
Simon: he's quiet, Pasta is quiet Pasta will you be quiet
Pasta: I AM OUTRAGED
Simon: SO what will what will you do in your advocate so far? (?)
Pepe: i told you🤦🏿‍♀️
Simon: don't you think you need to interface? So that uh-
Pasta 📙NO I HAVE to pray for this young woman as i read the scripture for her. (📖🕉️) MY DAUGHTER-
Pepe: say to him-
Simon: nonono😨😨👐🏿i ah i I shoud take charge of this
Pasta: I want to read for her
Simon: 👐🏿 nonono is not the place is not ready??
Pasta: ?????????
Pepe: Simon??? 👐🏿🗣️
Simon: 👐🏿😨 nononono I'm AFRAID Pasta I'm afraid???? Because👐🏿 my
Pasta: ???? ROCAMBUA BABABA?????? RIBASA????? CABABERE????? SIAMUWEONE???????
Simon: we wind up and that ends the show
Pasta: 📙📙📙?????????? 👆🏾👆🏾??????
submitted by CinnamonCat_ to copypasta [link] [comments]


2020.07.14 02:51 Knowbyheart94 Dreams and questions

I lost a close friend to suicide last September. I didn't know he was gone for over a month later. I had a dream about him that prompted me to Google his name and then I saw his obituary. I knew it was suicide because we had spoke. At length in person and in emails over that last few years about those feelings, about death and grieving, and supported one another emotionally over those things. He had lost two siblings only a month or so apart to suicide and struggled with coping. I had list my grandmother, my only mother figure. I confirmed it was a suicide by something his father posted on FB. But, I don't know how and it is shitty to ask.
I feel guilty because 2 years ago we almost finally got together, after 15 years of bad timing but consistent torch carrying for one another. He wanted a different type of relationship than I did ( he was polyamorous), and I had met someone I had strong feelings for who wanted something monogamous and we ended up married pretty quickly.
Myfiance had found writing about this friend and we decided not to continue with friendships of people we had had feelings for. The friend had written to me that it was very difficult to only be friends with me after we had basically admitted our love for one another. A few catch up how are you emails later and I told him that it was not appropriate to be friends anymore. I was pregnant and trying to move forward in life.
I feel guilty for not being a supportive friend for him in his final year. I dont know who he was even able to share his grief with? Maybe like me, he didnt have much support. He admitted at the time we almost got together that he had fallen I to a problem with painkillers.
I didnt really want to stop being friends, but I wanted my marriage to work. It really hasn't been going well either. Anyway in my grief I've felt many things, guilt as if I could have prevented it, guilt for I may have caused more pain than I wanted to, feeling like I have no right to even grieve, questioning my role in his heart and life ( I found posts by another lady friend he had known just as long that sounded incredibly similar to our story), guilty for grieving the death of someone I had strong feelings for while married to someone else.
When we had first met, as teenagers. We had a romantic night where I slept over and the album he played he later gave to me as a memento. I kept it through the years. I noticed as I listened to it online that the date of its release is the same as his death. I wondered if it was intentional? I still listen to it, I have through the years even when we weren't very in touch and on opposite sides of the planet. I looked to purchase it on vinyl last night. The front of the album art work is the enda of a instrument power cord shaped like a heart, but on the back of the album the rest of the chord is tied into a noose.
Needless to say, I now feel more than ever that the date wasnt a coincidence and I added to his pain in life much more than intended. I had a dream of him recently, he said he was trying to come back. That he changed his mind and regretted his choice and was coming back. We had spoken before about dreams of the dead and communication etc. I wish I could speak with a medium.
submitted by Knowbyheart94 to SuicideBereavement [link] [comments]


2020.01.29 20:52 louiseber [Updated Jan 2020] How many Irish Subs are there really?

The first time I made this post I had uncovered 500+ Irish related subs on reddit, from the abandoned to the large. This was some time in 2016ish and I have continued to try and track as many new subs as I can.
Below is the updated list, again including some of the Discord Servers & useful other external links (although not counted) and the count stands at 710 plus some redirects/banned subs/karma farms. I have also continued to included some of the North American Subs that could be mistaken for Irish just for information.
As you can see from the notations many, many of them are inactive but it's more about finding as many of them as possible than anything else.
If anyone knows of, or can find, new ones not listed below, throw them in the comments and I'll add them to the list. A rich vein of new ones continue to be towns etc, people from Ireland (bands etc) and products.
To any owners of Discords that appear on this list or not, let me know of perma invitation links as I know some of the below have expired but I'd rather have them as reminders/ place holders than not.
Notes:
To anyone who owns a sub...put a description in the bleedin' sidebar! (Growing is easier if people don't have to guess what the sub is for)
If you find a sub you might like to resurrect you can head over the /redditrequest and request to take it over. See their sidebar for full rules and process.
(P) = Currently Private Sub
(O) = Out of Use
(m) = Authors Notation
(NI) = Northern Ireland
(R) = Redirects

Visiting & Moving to Ireland

Also see ‘Hobbies & Interests’ and ‘Locations’ below.
General Discords

Irish Language/ As Gaeilge Subs

History & Heritage

Media, Music & Art

Media Discussion
News Subs
Media Creatives
Music
Underground Film & Music
Instruments
Dance
Art, Design & Visual

IT, Developers & Tech

Developers
Infrastructure
Data & Crypto
PC Parts
Gaming
  • See below

LGBT

Womens Issues

Teens

Health & Well-being Issues

Education Subs

Second Level
Third Level
Clubs/ Societies & College Interests

Political Parties/ Discussion

Discussions
Parties
State Institutions
Political Issues
Political Satire
Pol Discords

Model Government & Related Subs

Model Houses & Parties
Model Media
Model Meta & Misc

Religion & Religious Issues

Sports

GAA
Football
Teams
Fans Subs
Rugby
Other Sports

Jobs

Legal, Financial & Property

Legal
** Legal System**
Financial
Community Assistance
Bargains & For Sale
Earn Credit
Property

Transport

Rail
Buses
MotorBikes
Cars

Hobbies & Interests

Drug Culture
Vaping
Books
Board Gaming
Crafts
Computer Gaming
Discords
Tech Interests
Food & Drink
Dating & Social Groups
Events
Outdoor Activities
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submitted by louiseber to ireland [link] [comments]


2013.12.27 01:26 tabledresser [Table] IamA trans artist and educator who recently had gender reassignment surgery, AKA a vaginoplasty, AKA sex change operation! AMA!

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Date: 2013-12-26
Link to submission (Has self-text)
Questions Answers
how do you feel being transgender influenced your art? In terms of style, I'd say not a huge amount. I had a background in storytelling long before I came out as trans, and my artistic sensibilities as a solo artist were hugely influenced by my training as a high school and college student. I'd say, even if I weren't trans, any art I was making would probably take the same broad shapes: written work first, then experimented with in front of an audience as storytelling, then (sometimes, if it's good) turned into fully fleshed out solo pieces.
what is your favorite movie? However, the content of my work is incredibly influenced by my identity as trans. Almost all of my performances somehow revolve around my trans identity specifically, or larger themes of gender and sexuality in general.
did you have any transgender "celebrities" or personalities to look up to while in transition? Likewise, I'd say my politics are also heavily influenced by my trans identity: As someone who moved through the world as a straight, white, male, I've sort of gone to down the social scale quite a bit. Except that my race, and economic status, and educational background, and physical appearance all give me (unearned) privilege that often balances out (or even wins) over any oppression I might face as a trans person. So being trans has made me much more conscious of the racism/classism/etc I don't have to deal with, and made me much more interested in using my privilege to combat such oppression.
Ohh! This is a tough question! I don't know that I have A favorite, but some of my favorites are Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind, the LOTR trilogy, and Lion King.
Sort of. At the start of my transition - about seven years ago - there weren't as many. Kate Bornstein was definitely around, as was Jennifer Boylan and Julian Serano. But Laverne Cox wasn't on the radar yet, nor were sites like We Happy Trans or projects like The Trans 100. A big part of why I do the work I do (including things like this AMA) is because there weren't a lot of role models for trans kids like me, and I want to see that change.
EDIT: Obligatory 'thanks for the gold!' You popped my gilded cherry!
My question is, what do you think should be done or how should the current education and medical system be re-structured to be more supportive of trans teens and kids? I have been deeply saddened by the statistics and reports I've read about homelessness and suicide amongst transgender youth. That's a tough one. People get scared when anything about gender and sexuality is even hinted at with children. But adults over-think things. Saying "Well, most girls have vaginas, but some girls have penises" is complicated, but a lot simpler than saying "Well, see, there's socially constructed gender and biological gender. And we all have an assigned gender at birth, and..."
Bla bla bla. Way too complicated.
To kids, everything is new and confusing. The world is new and confusing. So saying "so and so used to be a man, and is now a woman" actually makes total sense to a five year old. (Believe me, I've seen it!) They tilt their head, think for a moment, and go "OK! Wanna play with blocks?"
Likewise, if Jimmy wants to wear a dress to school, or Susie wants to get a buzz cut, so what? Gender is almost entirely social for pre-pubescent kids. So if they want to experiment and play, I think they should be allowed (even encouraged) to do so. Yes, it may make things confusing or complicated for parents or teachers, but so what? I'd argue that kids have just as much right to self-determination (in terms of names and physical expression and clothing) as adults.
It's when you hit puberty that things get tricky. What many doctors are talking about these days is puberty/hormone blockers. That allows parents and doctors to buy some time for a 12 or 14 year old kid who is saying "I'm really $THIS_GENDER, not $THAT_GENDER," without putting them on body-altering hormones. Delaying puberty still sucks, but it gives you the chance to ask a 15 or 16 year old if they still feel that way, which is at least slightly less scary than putting a 12 year old on hormones.
And I acknowledge the legitimate fear parents have. As a trans person, I can honestly say that, yes, I "really knew" when I was 12. If I could send hormones back in time to myself as a kid, I would. But as a teacher who works with 12 year olds, I totally understand that it's terrifying letting a 12 year old decide when they want to have lunch, let alone how their body should be shaped through hormones. That's why those decisions should be made in consultation with doctors, therapists, and the parents. But I do think putting kids on hormones can - with those caveats - be a reasonable and legitimate course of treatment, even if it's scary.
Mrs.Garrison? Creative and original trolling?
Has your surgery affected your career at all? How do people react when they find out about it? In terms of how people react, I'm pretty darn out, so most people in my life (even people I'm not very close with) already know. But when I was first coming out, there was a range of reactions. Again, I was incredibly lucky that no one reacted super-negatively, but it took some people (my dad in particular) a long time to move from "this makes me uncomfortable" to "this clearly makes you happy, so I'm on board."
1) Congrats on the brave journey you have been on to reach a match in how you think, feel and look. I hope your soul, mind and body are at one now. > 1) Congrats on the brave journey you have been on to reach a match in how you think, feel and look. I hope your soul, mind and body are at one now.
2)silly question, stupid curiosity. How will orgasm work for you now. Sex is an important part in your journey, so its one that peaks my curiosity. > 2)silly question, stupid curiosity. How will orgasm work for you now. Sex is an important part in your journey, so its one that peaks my curiosity.
3)Will the nation have to follow suit now, and accept you for the physical female you are? Are there any red tape situations you have to go through for ID'ing yourself, via ID, Passports? If so, how and what steps as Americans can we take to make sure there is equality and consistency in the country//Globally? > 3)Will the nation have to follow suit now, and accept you for the physical female you are? Are there any red tape situations you have to go through for ID'ing yourself, via ID, Passports? If so, how and what steps as Americans can we take to make sure there is equality and consistency in the country//Globally?
Keep telling stories, overshare and be! It brings happiness! enjoy exploring your new ways of physical pleasure. And yeah, I definitely don't have any expectations about orgasm from vaginal penetration. Hoepfully everything will hook up right with my clit, though. They basically use the nerve endings from the tip of the penis, so it's analogous to natal/biological/cis/whatever language you wanna use anatomy. Obviously not exactly the same thing, but same broad stokes. (Pun not intended, but enjoyed.)
When did you tell your family that you did not feel comfortable with your gender and how did they react? I told my parents "I think I want to be a girl" when I was about 14. That was the language that made sense to me at the time, since 'trans' was this very weird thing that I was just starting to learn about online. I give them huge credit in that they didn't make things worse: didn't kick me out, didn't try to send me to reparative therapy, didn't stop loving me, etc.
What was specifically the worst part(s) about growing up and going through puberty in a body you were uncomfortable in? In fact, my mom said, "We will always love you." My dad said, "We'll love you, whatever you are. As long as you're not a Republican." (The source of my sense of humor has never been a big mystery.)
Before your surgery, how did potential partners react when you told them your situation? What about after your surgery (if that has come up since) ? That said, it took them much longer to 'get it.' Lots of activists talk about the difference between acceptance and support. They may use different words, but the general idea is that acceptance (or whatever it's called; sometimes 'tolerance' is used here) is a passive act: Don't kick someone out, don't call them names, don't fire them. Support requires action: finding ways to make specific changes to highlight your positive response to whatever is happening.
My parents were always accepting. It took them a lot longer to be supportive.
UGH! I think trans identity is not fundamentally different from any other human experience. So we all have changes that happen at puberty that are (at BEST!) uncontrollable and strange. Add to that growing hair everywhere (I have good Eastern European Jewish genetics), getting taller and bigger, all while seeing my female friends go in this seemingly glorious and impossible direction with their bodies. No surprise that I - like many trans people - had huge issues with depression and anxiety.
Because I'm so out, it hasn't been as big of an issue for me as it is for some trans people. I'm very upfront about being trans (including in OKCupid profiles and whatnot). This isn't because I think I have a responsibility to be out, or to disclose, but because - FOR ME - it makes more sense. I'd rather lose out on potential dating partners than have to deal with explanations or justifications.
I've definitely had some people I dated once or twice, who ultimately said "I can't deal with this." (They said it a little more politely than that, fortunately, but that's what it boiled down to.) Because they were polite and respectful, I don't hold them any ill-will, even though it was a bummer at the time.
I don't have any since-surgery stories...yet! ;)
Thank you for this AMA! I love that you over share, it frustrates me that people don't share enough. We need Trans role models, since I am not trans I cannot supply; but, definitely appreciate. And, I am interested in post-surgery encounter stories. hint hint Get better and get out there! Thanks so much! And I will definitely be writing about post-surgery experiences, and comparisons to pre-surgery. ::grin:: Pretty excited about that part, actually!
Could you go into any more detail about how I can go from 'acceptance/tolerance' to 'support'? Cheers:) Absolutely! Part of it is about being willing to educate yourself, and ask questions exactly like you are. I have a worksheet on allyship (PDF warning) that may be helpful, but let me know if you have questions beyond that.
Was there a lot of pain or discomfort post surgery The pain has been consistent, but also steadily decreasing. Right after surgery (so about 20 days ago), while still in the hospital, I was pushing my morphine button pretty regularly... Then I moved to Vicodin, which was very floaty. For the last week or so, I've been using half a Vicodin to sleep, but only Tylenol during the day, and not even that all the time. For the first week after surgery, I also had issues with constipation, which made everything worse. ICK! Fortunately, things are now moving smoothly, so to speak...
What so far has been the biggest hurdle to overcome since the operation? Honestly, boredom. I have Netflix, I just started re-reading LOTR for the first time in at least 10 years, and my dad got me a PS3 for my birthday/Chanukah, so I'm pretty well stocked. I also have lots of friends visiting. But I can't really go out (and it's fucking cold in Chicago), and I don't have much stamina. So I'm sitting around a lot. Healing is slow and boring business.
Wow, that's crazy. I apprciate the response, but you dont have to go into more detail about the dilation, the google image results were enough for me. I wish you the best of luck, and happy holidays. Ha! Thanks. Yeah, dilation is, um, kinda gross. Important, but kinda gross. ;)
do you think it would be better for society to change its expectations of the different genders rather than have people undergo surgery and take hormone supplements? That's an important question, and I'm sorry the speaker you saw sidestepped it.
I think the answer is yes and no. Yes, society should change its expectations for genders, but no, that doesn't mean people shouldn't undergo surgery or hormone replacement therapy.
That is, I think self-determination should be key. If someone was assigned female at birth, has XX chromosomes, menstruates, etc (meets all of the standard physical/biological definitions of "woman") but also wants to have a buzz cut, never wear makeup, and wear a suit and tie, I think she should be allowed to do so without people saying "You're not really a woman!" if the same person wants to undergo hormone replacement therapy and/or surgery, and start using male pronouns, they should be allowed to do that, too.
Would fewer people transition if we lived in a more permissive world? Maybe. But I'm not convinced. Transitioning isn't a small decision, or one made lightly, so I'm not totally sold on the argument that broader and less restrictive gender roles would remove the need to transition. To use myself as an example, I didn't want to wear dresses or have long hair as a man, I wanted to be (I identify as) a woman. To an outsider, the two may look very similar, but I promise that the lived experience is different.
So i absolutely think society would be better off with less restrictive gender roles (and that this would help men, too! feminism isn't just for women!). But I don't think that should come at the expense of people being able to transition.
Does that make sense?
What would you say to people who view gender identity issues as a mental issue similar to body dismorphia? (Spelling might be off) That's a totally legit question. I think there are a couple of ways to respond.
First and foremost, there are people who are functioning men and women, while body dysmorphia can result in people stating a desire for a body that does not or cannot naturally occur. So, from the very foundation, being trans is not about an objectively unobtainable desire or emotional state.
Delving a little deeper into treatment, you can talk to lots of trans people for whom transitioning (hormones and/or surgery and/or social change) works. That is, it makes them feel better. Which, ultimately, is the goal of medical or psychological intervention: to make someone feel better and be able to live a less difficult life. On the other hand, attempts at physically changing a person with body dysmorphia have not worked, while cognitive/behavioral therapy has worked. That would seem to indicate a fundamental difference between being trans and suffering from body dysmorphia, since 'reparative' therapies for trans people have never been shown to work.
Does that answer your question?
My question is this: when did you know you were trans? One of my friends has known all his life, but of course I know that it differs for every individual! You bring up a really good point, and one a lot of people (and the mainstream media...) often miss: Every trans experience is different. Said another way, there's no One Right Way To Be Trans. So some people realize or discover their trans identity pretty early, and others don't come into it until much later in life.
For me, I knew something was off with my gender as early as I can remember understanding I had a gender. But knowing "Boy is wrong for me" felt different than knowing "Girl is right for me." I describe it as follows: We've all had that experience of tossing and turning at night, knowing we're fucking uncomfortable but not knowing what comfort would look like. That's what it was like for me - I knew that I wasn't comfortable in the gender which I'd been assigned, but it took me a lot longer to figure out what would feel comfortable.
This was complicated by narratives of trans identity - online, in TV, movies, books, etc - that held there is One True Was To Be Trans. As a 13 year old first getting online, reading something that said "all trans people definitely want surgery" was kind of terrifying. I knew my body didn't quite feel right, but surgery was ALSO something I wasn't sure was right.
A much better model is sort of this a la carte idea of trans identity: you can pick and choose what feels right. In the same way there's no one right way to be a man or a woman, there's no one right way to be a trans man or a woman.
What could they do to be better accommodating and understanding? Educate themselves.
Believe their patients.
Number one is particularly a problem outside of big cities. Trans people are very often tasked with educating their doctors. That's not our job! I don't expect a GP to know everything about every identity experience, but I also don't expect them to quiz their patient about their body/experience/sex life/etc simply because the doctor is unwilling to do a google search or call a peer. There aren't a ton of resources for doctors, but there are more than zero.
Number two is an issue both in mental health and medical fields. My first therapist said that I probably wasn't trans, because I didn't fit her understanding of the identity: I wasn't obsessed with pink as a child, didn't kick and scream when my parents put me in a suit or tie, didn't actively hate my penis and want it cut off, etc. LOTS of trans people - particularly younger trans folks with a less solid idea of their identity - are told "You're not really trans" by bullshit authority figures. This isn't because they aren't really trans, but because they're young and their identity is still forming!
I'd also put at Step Zero is don't be an asshole. According to Injustice at Every Turn, a major survey of trans Americans, 28% of trans people have been harassed by a medical practitioner and 19% have been refused service outright. That's problematic on so many levels!
I was just looking at your website! The bummer is that my university caps compensation at $25 for speakers. They pretty much make it impossible for student clubs to bring in anyone unless they live near the school, but I am going to show my advisor your page and see if we can figure something out. That is tricky. What part of the country are you in? I can always let you know if I pass through on another gig.
Bay area in CA. Hence one of the reasons I think it is important that my school graduates students educated in GLBTQ issues. Feel free to email me (my contact info is on my website). I certainly hope to be through the Bay Area sometime soon!
Did you have to buy a whole new wardrobe? Yup! It happened slowly, over the course of a couple years, but I ultimately did end up with a new wardrobe. I realized I didn't hate shopping for clothing, I hated shopping for mens' clothing. Big difference!
Can you ever reproduce babies? I stored sperm on ice, in case I decide I want to contribute my genetics to the creation of a new life, but I won't be able to carry a child. I don't have a womb/uterus/eggs/etc.
Can you teach me how to put on eyeliner? I think youtube could do a better job! I'm getting slowly better, but still not great at eyeliner...
What's your birth name? Jared.
Can you orgasm? Hopefully! I could before surgery, which is generally a good indication of being able to after surgery. But it'll take another few weeks (at least) for my nerves to calm down and my brain to figure out this new configuration between my legs. Fingers crossed, though!
My mum wants me to be something I'm not and will never be. You're very lucky. I appreciate that. I try to be conscious of how lucky I am, and not take it for granted.
how do your work colleagues treat you openly and behind closes doors? I hope so! I could achieve multiple orgasms every so often pre-surgery, so fingers crossed for post!
Again, I've been lucky in that my colleagues have been really supportive.
What's the biggest misconception you think people have about the surgery and gender reassignment in general? Also, congratulations and good luck with your recovery! Well, it's not 'cutting off your dick,' it's a lot more complicated (probably NSFW). Beyond that, I'd say everyone is super duper surgery focused, when there's a lot more than that that goes into transitioning.
What were the worst things about being so different? Honestly, a lack of community. Part of the reason I do the education work I do (including this AMA) is because there aren't a ton of people out there speaking intelligently about trans experiences. Of those that are speaking out, many (although certainly not all) are older, white, privileged trans women who often don't take time to speak about racism/classism and other hardships facing trans folks.
How do you approach dating? Not having a strong community makes it difficult to know when something is 'normal' or not, when an emotional experience is hard-but-standard or really out of the ordinary, etc. Likewise, it makes it that much more difficult to explain things to friends/family/etc, if you don't have people you can talk to about how they went through the same experiences.
Answered here but lemme know if you have additional questions.
When you tell people that you've had a sex change, does anyone ever react negatively? If so, how do they react and how often does it happen? I'd say I'm pretty careful in my social and professional life to avoid situations where people would be total jerks. (Reddit AMAs being the exception, obviously!) but people are more confused than negative, which is part of the reason I try to do educational things like this AMA.
Confused? In what way? Well, in the same way a lot of these questions come across: Totally well-intentioned (usually) but entirely ignorant of how trans identity works. Which is OK! It's not usually taught in school...
So I try - as much as time and patience and emotional safety will allow - to meet people where they're at, and answer all questions with the assumption that they're asked with good intent.
Who was your surgeon? How has your experience with them been? I went with Dr Christine McGinn, out of Philadelphia. I decided pretty early on that I wanted to stay in North America, and the top US/Canadian doctors are Bowers (out of the Bay Area), Meltzer (Arizona), Brassard (Montreal) and McGinn. After meeting with Bowers, Meltzer, and McGinn, I just clicked with her.
I like her as a surgeon a lot, as well as her physicians assistant Heather. That said (and I knew this going in) she's pretty blunt and straight forward. Her bedside manner isn't bad or rude, but it's not particularly touchy-feely. My mom was there the entire time, which was good; advice I got from another woman who had seen McGinn was to have a good strong ally who can be there with you (ideally more than just a friend to take you to/from the hospital) because McGinn is not an incredibly warm person. Again, I like her a lot, and found her manner to be totally OK, but I can understand why someone might prefer Meltzer, who is supposed to have amazing bedside manner and an awesome post-op setup.
I actually really wanted to see McGinn myself but she refused my insurance. Not entirely sure who I want to go to now, but Bowers so far is the only one who said they would accept my insurance. I'm sorry to hear that! But Bowers is also pretty great. I had the bad luck of getting NO insurance coverage. (I have insurance, but trans surgery is explicitly excluded.) The silver lining, I suppose, is that I was able to choose whoever I wanted, without considering insurance coverage.
what are your thoughts on "cisphobia" ? This is a hella controversial topic so I totally understand if you don't want to start anything (looks like you have enough haters as it is...) but thank you for doing this AMA and spreading education and awareness! So, for those not familiar with the lingo, cis (or cisgender) is the opposite or antonym of transgender. Trans = someone whose gender identity (sense of self as a gendered being) does not match their assigned sex at birth. Cis = someone whose gender identity mostly pretty well matches up with their assigned sex at birth.
I say 'mostly pretty well' because gender is complicated. Someone can be cis and still not like or be happy with societal expectations around gender. Where cis/trans come into play is more about how you can expect a doctor, or police officer, or TSA agent to treat your gender. As a trans person, my experience going to the doctor is more complicated than for most cis people.
That's why I think cis is an important term, because it allows us to talk about privilege and systems of poweoppression.
BUT, there are definitely trans or gender non-conforming folks out there who respond to the problems of cis privilege by becoming anti cis. I think this is problematic, just as I think it's problematic when a person of color speaks negatively about ALL WHITE PEOPLE EVER.
I do think it's important to call people out on their privilege. There are definitely cis activists (even LGB cis folks) who have said super problematic things about trans people, often unintentionally. They shouldn't get a free pass, simply because they're also doing good work elsewhere. (::cough:: HRC I'm looking at you ::cough::) But I don't think being a member of an oppressed minority - as trans folks are - gives you free reign to paint all members of a power-holding class (in this case, cis folks) as inherently evil or bad.
Of course, I speak from huge positions of privilege that allow me to say that: I'm white, I'm middle-class, I'm educated, I have huge family and friend support, I have passing privilege (that is, I'm generally perceived to be a 'real' cis woman, and people don't usually perceive me as trans without me telling them), etc, etc.
I heard a trans woman of color speak really beautifully on a panel about the 'angry tranny' idea. She said that, if you get up and your mom misgenders you, and you walk out the door and you're called trannyfaggot on the street, and you get on the bus and the driver laughs in your face, and you get off the bus and the receptionist at the store looks at you like you're disgusting, and on and on and on, yeah, you're gonna get a little defensive.
So I think claims of cisphobia are a little overwrought, and stem from the very very real oppression that trans people face. But I would also hope that other trans people would take a deep breath and try to speak from a position of respectful calm, even when we're right and they're wrong. Not because we "should," but because I think it'll be more productive.
(Sidenote: this is part of a larger discussion of working within the system versus working from outside. Malcom X versus Dr King, or Magneto versus Prof X. I'm generally somewhere tilting toward the latter - of working from within the system - with hints of revolutionary in me. But, again, I imagine I'd have a very different mindset if I'd been kicked out of my house at 16 and forced into sex work.)
I think, though, what really annoys me is when cishet people insist that angry activism is wrong and should stop because "we won't get anywhere if we aren't nice to the majority!!!11!!!" It's like, first you're telling me I can't be who I am inside, and then you're telling me that I can't even get ANGRY about it??? Makes me want to punch stuff. > I think, though, what really annoys me is when cis people insist that angry activism is wrong and should stop because "we won't get anywhere if we aren't nice to the majority!!!11!!!" It's like, first you're telling me I can't be who I am inside, and then you're telling me that I can't even get ANGRY about it??? Makes me want to punch stuff.
How are your views on the advancement of trans social issues? In the last 10 years I've witnessed a huge advance in gay rights, etc., but it seems to me that trans typically gets left behind and, at times, seems to almost be looked down upon by the gay community. It's always kinda bothered me. I'd definitely say trans rights are behind gay rights, in part because (as you noted) sexuality is easier for most people to grasp than gender identity. Likewise, there's been an undercurrent of "we'll come back for you!" among many cis activists in the LGB community, which generally hasn't worked too well. (See: Has ENDA passed yet?)
How did you pick your female name?! More broadly, I do think trans rights can fall under the "we're just like you" umbrella of gay rights, but it takes a little more work. For gay rights, it's that everyone has a right to love who they love. For trans rights, it's that everyone has a right to be who they are. I'd argue that - at a deep level - trans identity isn't very different from cis identity: We all want to feel comfortable in our own skin. But because most people never give their gender a second thought, talking about trans identity is often a harder sell than talking about sexual orientation. That's changing, slowly but steadily, but we still have a long ways to go before trans rights will seem as inevitable (if long-delayed) as gay rights.
My answer is kind of boring: It was one of the names my parents picked for me before I was born, and they told me when I was about 12 and doing a genealogy project for school. So I always felt that my name (Rebecca) was just...my name. I didn't need to pick it.
For other trans people I know, it runs the gamut. Some, like me, used a name their parents had chosen before they were born. Some picked a name from a baby book, or from a real or fictional name they liked. Some actually asked their parents to pick a new name, as a way of getting them on board and involved with the transitioning process.
As a trans girl pre-transition I want to know. How often is discrimination against you for being trans? How long do it think it will take until trans rights are given mainstream attention? > How often is discrimination against you for being trans?
Fortunately, not that often. In part, that reflects my other privileges: race, economic, education, etc. But it also has to do with the industry I'm in, both in terms of academia (colleges are generally liberal) and the arts in general. As I've said elsewhere in this thread, I've been very fortunate as a trans woman.
> How long do it think it will take until trans rights are given mainstream attention?
It's slowly happening. Things like Orange Is The New New Black (and Laverne Cox being AWESOME in interviews) helps, as does Obama nudging the state department and HHS in that direction. It's gonna take time, and it requires people to be out and proud, but I think we're going in the right direction. Lots of two steps forward, one step back kinda situations, though.
I don't watch Orange Is The New Black but I'm glad it exists. Also, I'm glad you're so lucky. I'm white, lower middle-class and a trans girl so I'm a bit safe but must be cautious. Anyways, thanks for taking the time to respond :) You're welcome! And I wish you all good things, and please stay safe!
I waste of most of my time on the computer. Ah the joy of being a teenager. :P Although people can automatically discount your opinions because of it :( Meh. I haven't been a teenager in quite some time, but i still spend most of my time on a computer ;)
How long did the entire process take? Any other surgeries planned or do the hormones work well? Best of luck with the healing! > How long did the entire process take? Any other surgeries planned or do the hormones work well? Best of luck with the healing!
Last updated: 2013-12-30 22:44 UTC
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